| smokinrav |
Please excuse the thread being in the wrong forum. I speak only english and have a hard time telling if I am in the right place. Thanks :)
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Unlike every other cloning method, water cloning requires no rooting hormone, humidity dome, ph check or specific kind of water to make it work. The cuttings snipped end is inserted in water and simply continues on as if nothing had happened, transpiring moisture through its leaves, keeping water pressure up the proper way, from stem to leaves, as oposed to artificial room humidity. Ph and water quality are similarly non issues because there is no root system to be affected by either factor.
Most cloning methods demand low light levels to keep your cutting in stasis. Water cloning is especially susceptible to light degradation. Excessive light will force any cutting to photosynthesize. Since the plant has no roots to support the growth this light tries to force, it will do what plants always do and begin draining the sugars stored in the leaves for food. The leaves will yellow and shrivel and eventually fall off the plant. When the leaves are all gone its unlikely your clone will survive. This response can also be seen in nutrient deficiencies and other problems with the plants medium and explains most yellowing seen in grow rooms today. Keeping light levels low and the plant in actual stasis will allow it to grow roots and keep almost all it's leaves green and healthy all the way to transplant. The very health of a fully green plant will somewhat mitigate the speed advantage other cloning methods have that end up with yellowed and withered leaves upon rooting. They still have to grow back those leaves that water cloning keeps.
The first picture is a clone I kept in the water for eight weeks. It continued to grow roots until I removed and planted it
The last picture is my mother room and two generations of clones rooting |
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| smokinrav |
When a cutting begins developing roots in water, small white nubs will begin growing off the bare stem. These will elongate into recognizable roots and continue developing in the water for nearly as long as you leave them exposed. The cutting is able to be transplanted at any time these get more than ½” long or so. The root system can also be left alone to get huge, much bigger than the cutting itself, so big I feared the wet weight of it would rip it loose from the stem. It’s a good idea to change the water every few days or so and to keep temps above 70, but the cuts will almost always root if this maintenance is observed or not.
Transitioning the plants to soil is as simple as digging a hole big enough to hold what you’re planting and gently reburying the roots until the stem is firmly set. Feed them a ½ strength balanced fertilizer making sure to saturate the soil. The wetter it is the easier it will be on roots only used to being in water. Move the clones back under the light they were rooted under for a couple of days and then you can gradually introduce them to vegetative lighting.
Superthrive will help the transition from water to soil as well. Water cloning is ideal for hydroponic setups |
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| smokinrav |
Some of the uses and benefits I have found for water cloning include:
-Propagation
-Keeping a certain line of genetics in stasis, be it for room cleaning, infestation, breeding or going on vacation. Since the water does not have not have be changed, figure out a way to keep the stems exposed to water for the duration of your trip and go.
-Collecting male pollen. Remove a branch from a male with un-dropped flowers and water cloning it will keep it healthy until it does drop its pollen onto a collection surface
-Sexing plants from seed. A cutting from an unsexed plant will show flower in a week or so if put in a room with 12/12 lighting. No maintenance required, so they can just sit in your flower room using ambient light
-Taking cuttings that are extremely large. You have seen rooted clones 12” tall and 8”broad. No other cloning method can do this.
-Cloning hard to propagate strains
Some of the drawbacks and negatives of water cloning are:
-Inconsistent rooting speed. Few cuttings show roots on the same day unless you have a lot of them. I usually take twice as many as I need to ensure I get all the individual plants for my goals at around the same time.
-Excessive time for roots to develop compared to methods using accelerants. 14 days for roots to show is not unusual.
-A transition period other methods don’t require.
Water cloning is tried and true, 100% effective if you give the cutting enough time to root. I’ve thrown some out, but they were, in general, still green and healthy looking when they hit the recycle pile. Better yet, it’s a pure method, with one less foreign substance being used to grow your plants. In four years of cloning this way, I have tried nearly everything you can think of related to cannabis to speed rooting, and nothing has any effect except the time it takes to grow. I don’t try anymore because the water and the method are pure as they are. |
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| smokinrav |
At one point last year, I went on vacation for 15 days. Water cloning helped keep my room alive for my return.
In the second pic, we have a round piece of polypropylene, basically styrofoam the same stuff found in most packing material, cut to fit inside a pot with straight sides for several verticle inches. The pot is filled with water, and the cuttings are inserted through the foam. The foam is settled on the waters surface and that's basically it. As the water evaporates and the cuttings suck out the water, the foam will drop evenly down, keeping all it's stems submerged.
I returned 15 days later and found all cuttings with either well developed roots or at least nubs.
Some examples in the last two pics.
Don't pull the clones out of the foam, break it apart to remove them. Roots could rip off when going back through the small hole. |
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| inVALIDa |
You put clones to soil when they have Lots of roots??? (1st image)
Its too late, or not??
Sorry , my English is not well :) |
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| smokinrav |
You can transplant anytime after roots are 2 cm long or more for small clones, and you need larger roots for larger clones.
That's OK, I cant understand a word on this site and we can still talk the same language. |
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| smokinrav |
At one point, I grew out some Sweet Cindy, a SweetTooth x Cinderella99. It auto flowered on me. That was my first I had ever seen and I've never seen anything like it (from what I later learned, this trait is common in the ST). Male and female showed at 14 days from seed. Males were dropping pollen at roughly 21 days. Females showed alternate branching at the same time the male pollen was dropping. I had intended to breed them, and the males would pollenate both it's own females and a Rosetta Stone I had been growing for years, but this was looking less likely as pollen filled my veg area.
The easiest solution was to collect the stuff, and since I had been continuing plants for so long with water cloning, I decided to try and stick several entire male branches in water, just before they released most of they're load.
It worked better than I could have possibly expected. The males were long enough that they hung over a glass on an angle enough to keep the droppings on the (freshly cleaned) glass and out of the water. Over the couse of five days, they left at least a full gram on the glass, along with the remains of male flower petals(?)
Eventually, I removed the petals and had a lot of pure pollen. I mixed it up at a 1:10 pollen to flour ratio and have stored it in the fridge ever since.
Pollen is mixed with plain kitchen flour to dilute the grains and make it last longer. Flour is also a natural dessicant and will keep excess moisture away from the grains during storage. |
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| smokinrav |
Water cloning seems to be able to root nearly any size cutting. At least, Ive done a 16"er before and it was ridiculous. I'll find the pics. Took many weeks to root, though at the time I was operating under the mistaken impression that the root system had to be somewhat equal to the size of the clone for success. Later experiments showed that 12"ers can root to soil with just a few roots an inch long.
Some examples of very small clones are pictured
I have found the bigger it is the longer it takes to grow roots, but that is NOT set in stone (Ive had 8"ers root in 7 days and two inchers not root for a month). I once tried to make an argument that this extended rooting time could be made up on the back end bu using a plant possessing two weeks of veg growth and healthy leaves, but even those advantage cant make up for the month in the water it took to get to soil. If I can figure out a way to root these plants this size in a week or so, it could bring about major change in indoor growing.
Many growers using conventional cloning methods make sure a trimmed off node is close to the cut end because roots grow more quickly from there. Nodes and root growth in water cloning is somewhat of a mystery, however. Sometimes roots grow from them and most times they dont. I believe in other methods they sprout from nodal areas more aften than not, right?
People say scarification will speed root development, and it clearly does in conventional methods, but the couple times Ive done it got me stem rot. This area deserves much more research though due simply to their being so much positive anecdotal evidence. |
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| loeX |
| pochopil sem správně že de o to hodit řízky do destilovaný vody? angličtinu se učím dost dlouho ale nějak to ještě moc nedávám... |
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| smokinrav |
| Sorry, I don't understand....... |
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| zike |
| It is very useful method, esspecially for us with hydro system and also suit for Sea of Green. K+ |
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| smokinrav |
Agreed, very useful and easy due to the low maintenance.
zike, could you translate the post three up from this one? |
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| zike |
Loex was just asking something about your water cloning you wrote above..he can't speak english...i try to explain it to him if you don't mind..
2 Loex: nic o destilce sem tam teda necet? pise tam jenom o obyc vode jinak zkus vzit slovnik a aspon se trochu procvicis.... |
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| lordWilliam |
The idea with polypropylene is simply genious ;-°) But i thing that Your clones are very big with too much leafs. Do U use any rooting stimulator? Btw. Your mother plant is impresive.
I`am sorry for my english ;-°)
How do U found Grower.cz? :-°))) |
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| lordWilliam |
| And Loex question is about water, Do U use destilated water, normal water or special liguid for clones? |
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| zike |
| citace: |
Původní příspěvek od smokinrav
Unlike every other cloning method, water cloning requires no rooting hormone, humidity dome, ph check or specific kind of water to make it work. |
everythink is written here, is it??? :confused: |
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| lordWilliam |
Yeah, I`am sorry but I`am too lazy and too stoned to translating :-°)))
To Loex: Používá se jakkoliv neupravená voda, prostě jen odstátá z vodovodu. |
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| loeX |
| i can speak englich but your article is too much dificult for my knowledge...i understand 75% percent so i am not so bad:-) i thought that plain water is destiled water..thats all..my czech friends explained it to me... |
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| Soul Rebel |
Neumim englicky, mohli byste nekdo, prosim, v jednoduchosti shrnout v cem to spociva?
Dekuji:) |
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| Stoned_r41d3r |
Tak jo, deti....
Narozdil od jinych metod, tahle nevyzaduje zadne korenove hormony/stimulatory, parnicky, ci mereni PH.
Orezana cast rezu se vlozi do vody a tam je, dokud se neco nestane.
Ph ci kvalita vody neni v tomto pripde problem, protoze rezy nemaji zadne koreny.
Vetsina klonovacích metod vyzaduje méně světla a tahle je svetelnou degradaci obzvlaste narocna.
Protoze kytka nema koreny, je nucena svetlem k tomu, aby se chovala normalne, nicmene, z duvodu neexistence korenu si bere sacharidy z listu. Tyto listy zezloutnou a opadaji z rostliny. Jakmile listy opadaji, vas rizek zemre. Proto drze svetlo na nizke urovni a kytka v pohode zakoreni.
Na prvni fotce je klon starys 8 tydnu, druha je matkarna a rizkarna....
Nespokojenci s prekladem nech mi libaji srnu! |
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| Sinuhet |
| Klonovani ve vode, je ma vecna vyzva zkousel jsem to x krat podle x ruznych navodu. Nikdy to nezakorenilo. |
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| Stoned_r41d3r |
Jakmile zacnou rizky delat korinky, male bile bobulky se zacnou objevovat na ponorene strane stonku. Ty se vyvinou do normalnich korenou a budou dale rust. Rizky jsou pripraveny na presazeni, jakmile maji korinky delsi, nez pul palce. Je dobry napad menit vodu kazdy den a udrzovat teplotu pod 70 fahrenheita <ja bych to videl tak na 23 celsia>, nicmene, rizek bude rust i bez udrzby :D
Preneseni rizku do hliny je jednoduche, proste vyhlubte otvor dost velky na to, aby udrzeta vasi kytku a jemne zakryjte koreny hlinou, dokud neni stonek rizku stabilni. Nakrmte je 1/2 davkou rustoveho hnojiva. Cim vlhci puda,tim lepe pro koreny zvykle na rust ve vode <pozor na utopeni, zase> Preneste klony ny par dni zpet pod svetlo kde korenily a pak muzou byt uvedeny do vegetacni faze na ostro.
Dejwiku, to si delas prdel, ne? Mas to v postu nad tvym jeste cesky. Dotazy? |
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| Dejwik |
| Its very usefull method, but is there any way, how to put clones back to ground (im not sure ive used right word so sorry about that but try to understand please) ? I worry ill damage roots too much and my loved plant will die. |
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| Stoned_r41d3r |
Nektere z vyhod vodniho klonovani:
-Propagace
Zachovavani genetiky pro slechteni, pripadne odjezdy na dovolenou.
Protoze neni nutne, aby byla voda menena, vymyslete jak udrzet stonek pod vodou, nez se vratite
Sber samciho pylu. Useknete vetev ze samce s neotevrenymi kvety a vodni klonovani vam umozni udrzet ji zdravou, nez vypada pyl.
Zjistovani pohlavi rostlin. Rizek z rostliny s neznamym pohlavim ukaze kvety po tydnu 12/12. Zadna dalsi udrzba neni potreba.
Rezani Ooooobrovskych klonu. Vidite koreni 12palcove klony co jsou 8 palcu siroke <oooo>. Zadna jina to pry nedokaze
Negativa
Nesoumerna rychlost koreneni. Autor pro jistotu reze 2x tolik klonu
Casove narocna metoda. 14 dni do ukazani prvnich korinku je nesrovnatelne s pouzitim korenovych stimulatoru...
Vodni klonovani je odzkoueno a na 100% funkcni,pokud date klonu dost casu. Nektere klony jsem zahodil, ale prakticky byly jeste pouzitelne, kdyz zavadili o dno kose na odpadky. Ke vsemu, je to cista metoda bez pouziti chemikalii a jinych veci, co nemate doma po ruce.
Autor klonuje touto metodou uz 4 roky a pry odzkousel vsechny dostupne alternativy. Nicmene, zustal u ,,cisteho'' vodniho klonovani...
Opet, zadam o polibeni srny v pripade nespokojenosti. |
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| Stoned_r41d3r |
A k poslednimu obrazku ciste vlastnimi slovy.
Nadoba na vodu+ polystyren s vyvrtanyma dirkama.
Klony jsou prostrkany skrz diry do hrnce.
Jakmile se voda zacne vyparovat/klony ji zacnou spotrebovavat, zacne klesat i hladina, nicmene, diky tomu, ze kytky jsou chyceny v poly, klesaji spolecne s hladinou. Nepokousejte se klony dostat ven skrz dirku,lepsi je poly rozlamat,aby se koreny neposkodily...
Dale se autor venuje opyleni a vraci se zpet k uz nastinene myslence, ktera uz je IMHO jasna a timto okamzikem priblizne prelozena- ergo- I am OUT. |
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| Pindulinka |
sweet results smokin, Im just wondering how its possible to root clones without darkness at the roots. Do you think thats strain specific?
I use a bubble cloner with an airstone I built on the cheap. Darkness was always very important for rooting.
P. |
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| ravalium08001 |
yeah dats what i think-darkness is important for the rooting no?
but as we know the weed never ceases to amaze us.to me the only possible of those ways is the one with the styrofoam.
jo ja si stejne jako Pindulinka myslim ze tam, kde porostou koreny ma bejt tma...ale trava dokaze prekvapit jak vime.me se jako jedina mozna zda metoda s tim polystyrenem. |
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| Machoman |
| citace: |
Původní příspěvek od ravalium08001
yeah dats what i think-darkness is important for the rooting no?
but as we know the weed never ceases to amaze us.to me the only possible of those ways is the one with the styrofoam.
jo ja si stejne jako Pindulinka myslim ze tam, kde porostou koreny ma bejt tma...ale trava dokaze prekvapit jak vime.me se jako jedina mozna zda metoda s tim polystyrenem. |
Tma tam být rozhodne nemusí. Zkoušel jsem nařezat 2ks cheese,hodil do panakovky s obyčejnou neupravenou vodou z kohoutku a přepnul na kvet. Za 2 týdny to pustilo první kořínky-mel sem to dany dole pod kytkama,ale svetlo se k nim dostávalo i tak dost. |
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| smokinrav |
Testing......
Hey Grower.CZ nice to see you all again. |
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